S2 Ep.6 Cult Classics
Cult Classics - Transcript
[JAMIE] I feel like this episode is really gonna give my nerdy upbringing a chance to shine. [laughs]
[KARLI] It is. This is a good spotlight for you.
[JAMIE] Yeah, it's really gonna like, highlight my family's peculiarities. I remember, when I would have friends come over, they'd walk into our house and we had like a wall of action figures and nerd paraphernalia from like Star Wars, Star Trek, like all on the wall. And they were like, who? Whose stuff is this? And we're like, that's my dad’s. [laughs] Those are my dad's toys. We're not allowed to touch them.
[KARLI] I remember coming to your house and thinking it was super rad that your dad was into all of that stuff. I was like, this is like living, like this is your living space. And there's just nerdy stuff everywhere.
[JAMIE] His office looks the same today. He's the main source of my uh, my nerd.
[KARLI] That's pretty great. It's pretty great.
[JAMIE] My well of nerd runs deep.
[KARLI] Yeah. Deep and wide.
[INTRODUCTION MUSIC PLAYS]
[JAMIE] Welcome to The Act Break, where we're talking about all things story.
[KARLI] Take a break from your creative endeavors and hang out with us.
[JAMIE] Have a little simulated human interaction.
[KARLI] Because internet friends totally count.
[INTRO MUSIC FADES]
[JAMIE] Welcome back, everybody. We know you have a choice when it comes to podcasts. And we thank you for choosing The Act Break. There are hundreds of podcasts packed with famous, interesting people, experts and talented professionals. So the fact that you were here with us has us grateful humbled and a little bit worried for you. [Karli laughs] But you're here now, we must move forward. I'm Jamie, a storytelling fiction enthusiast. And this is my co-host, Karli. Tell the folks who you are.
[KARLI] I'm Karli.
[JAMIE] Accurate.
[KARLI] I strive for accuracy. [laughing] That’s the one thing I can guarantee is that I am accurately myself whether or not I'm entertaining is a completely different matter. [both chuckle] Anyways, I'm Karli, a writer, book buff, and late to the film buff game, but no less a fan for it.
[JAMIE] I am hoping that this episode will be not too complicated because it can—the topic today of cult classics or cult films or midnight movies can get a little squishy. And I'm darned determined to not have this be like the MacGuffin episode where we say the word a billion times. [both laugh] But it might be.
[KARLI] Yeah. The MacGuffin episode could be a drinking game.
[JAMIE] You'd be messed up, you'd get so messed up. [laughs]
[KARLI] [laughing] Don’t make it a drinking game. So I'm hopeful it's not like the MacGuffin episode as well. But I am way less familiar with this topic than you. So I might be the problem here. But to start off, I'd like to ask what is a cult classic? Like what—what are the parameters in order for it to fall into that category? Because I did not grow up with cult classic films. Can you explain to me what, what is this thing?
[JAMIE] I'll start by saying, I am not an expert.
[KARLI] Well—pfft—that’s been a disclaimer throughout. That's just The Act Break Podcast. Disclaimer. “We are not experts, carry on.”
[JAMIE] We don't know what we're talking about. And so it's a term some people might have heard of. It's used mostly in cinema. The big question, like you said, is what defines like, what are the definitive traits? Because most people if they've never heard of it, or have never been part of the culture, hear the word cult, and it's a red flag.
[KARLI] [laughing] It is a red flag.
[JAMIE] It's not a cult, or is it?
[LAUGHTER]
[BOTH] Mmmm. Mmmm?
[JAMIE] So the term originated first in the 1970s as cult films or cult movies. That is a film that is acquired a cult like following, like the first super fans, but for movies that were out of the mainstream.
[KARLI] Okay.
[JAMIE] Represented by fans that create their own subculture based around the work, e.g. repeated viewings, quoting audience participation, that sort of thing.
[KARLI] Okay.
[JAMIE] The term is also traced back to suppressed or controversial films that were kept alive due to the avid fan base. Usually it had to be something that bombed at the box office. Some of the most famous examples have become Rocky Horror Picture Show, A Clockwork Orange, Evil Dead.
[KARLI] Okay. Okay.
[JAMIE] Pulp Fiction.
[KARLI] I'm following now, I'm following, okay.
[JAMIE] Yeah. So in that was like the original thing was that they didn't earn their money back or were just a little too weird for the everyday movie goer. [chuckles]
[KARLI] But then all, like a niche group of weirdos came out and were like, we love this. We're adopting it. It's ours now. And then they became like you said, the super fans. That makes so much sense to me now. Like I said, I didn't grow up with it. So I've heard the term obviously, I haven't been living under a rock. At least in this regard. Cult is a really weird word. But now that you explain what the like, where the term originated, I'm like, mmm, okay, that tracks. Because I was gonna say our language choices sometimes are really weird, but that makes more sense.
[JAMIE] Yeah. As with everything over the years, the term has seemed to morph and get a little bit squishy, and in some instances, almost lost all meaning.
[KARLI] [laughs] Like MacGuffin.
[LAUGHTER]
[JAMIE] Yeah. One of the things we talk about a lot here at The Act Break is sub-genre. And the cult classics are no different. They have a lot of sub genres that that can go into. So bad, it's good. [Karli chuckles] Modern cult classics are like their own. And the modern ones is where the definition kind of falls away. Because there are a lot of like, [chuckles] if you use Google who—I hate Google—[Karli chuckles] but if you use it, it'll show you things that were like smash box office hits, that are widely regarded as great movies. And I'm like, I get that Mean Girls has a crazy following, but it was popular at the time it came out.
[KARLI] Yeah.
[JAMIE] So was Bridesmaids.
[KARLI] Yeah.
[JAMIE] Neither of those are cult classics. But they made a bunch of lists. What are you talking about?
[KARLI] I agree with that, but I definitely found some squishy examples. So I'm glad you brought that up. But so like the, the so bad, it's good. I mean, I would say that that's like, Evil Dead. [laughs]
[JAMIE] I would say it kind of depends. Because I think that that's kind of more of like a horror sub-genre.
[KARLI] Well yeah, but it could fall into both, I think.
[JAMIE] I'm trying to remember because I am less familiar with Evil Dead, and much more familiar with Army of Darkness. A lot of the so bad, it's good categories come out of the like 40s and 50s when production value [Karli chuckles] was so low, and the pool of actors was very small. [laughs] So performances are bad. And yeah, so bad, it's good.
[LAUGHTER]
[KARLI] Okay, okay.
[JAMIE] It's very Mystery Science Theater 3000. You watch it for the joy of it's [laughing] awful-ness.
[KARLI] I feel like this episode is just gonna be me writing down things that I have to add to my list of movies to watch.
[JAMIE] Yeah, my standard is, lack of mainstream recognition, or at least until a much later date.
[KARLI] Right. Like initially, it had to have been not widely accepted.
[JAMIE] I like offbeat humor. And a lot of them have a very—their own very distinct feel, tone or cinematography style. They're very distinct feels.
[KARLI] Yes. That makes sense. I agree. I, if I'm going to watch something, like that, I want to see something offbeat, quirky. And I don't necessarily like the ones that they're so bad that they're good. I mean, I can't like blanket statement because I've not seen a ton of them. But I would definitely want more, more humorous than not, personally.
[JAMIE] Yeah. Like, you want them to have been funny on purpose like, Young Frankenstein.
[KARLI] I don't know. I haven't seen that. [laughs]
[JAMIE] It's it's Mel Brooks.
[KARLI] Oh okay.
[JAMIE] Lots of jokes. Jokes, jokes, jokes.
[KARLI] Right.
[JAMIE] And because it gets squishy. Let's talk about modern cult classics that have been like released in the last, let's say twenty years. So 2000s Maybe some in the 90s that are like The Big Lebowski. Which I know you have seen.
[KARLI] Yes. And that one is on my lesson like hey, I've seen one! [laughs] Go me. [laughs]
[JAMIE] Others that are more recent would be like Donnie Darko, [chuckles] Napoleon Dynamite.
[KARLI] I have that one on my list too.
[JAMIE] That one is so funny because it's like we all know that was huge. When it came out and I was in high school, I had a friend. And we went and saw Napoleon Dynamite like three times and we could not get anybody to go with us. People were like, we're not going. As soon as it came out to like DVD, it blew up. [laughs] And it was like the first cult classic that I had, like, seen happen in my time. [laughs]
[KARLI] Mmmm. Gotcha.
[JAMIE] That I was like, aware of.
[KARLI] Yeah, I didn't see it until it came out on DVD. And I didn't get it at first because again, I didn't understand what they were trying to do. I thought they were trying to make, not they were trying to make. [chuckles] I, I didn't get it. Then I rewatched it and I'm like, oh, I get it. I love it. This is fantastic.
[JAMIE] One of many examples where it's like, it has a very distinct feel, color tone. So many of these films are just very, like you can tell what movie they are within one shot. Yeah, The Boondock Saints, that's another that got way big, but way after. It was horribly marketed at the time, I think. [laughs]
[KARLI] That's one of my favorites. Me and the mechanic, we watch that a lot.
[JAMIE] A good example of box office failure, and then going on to epic success is Fight Club. It took $65 million to make and brought home less than 60% at the box office domestically. So it only made like $30 million when it came out. [laughs] But now that's like one of the most like recognized movies. People, people love it.
[KARLI] Yep. I love it. You love it. We all love it. [chuckles]
[JAMIE] And then I was just kind of interested in--what were some of your favorites? Even though I we've mentioned a couple of them. So...
[KARLI] Like I said, I don't have as wide a viewing range as you because my cult classic experience has come in as an adult. And I even have some questions because I'm like, I don't even know if this qualifies, because obviously I didn't really understand what it was until we started, we hit the record button. I'm curious about a more modern one, Idiocracy? Would you classify that as a cult mod—like a modern cult classic?
[JAMIE] I think so. Because it wasn't marketed very well. It didn't make a lot of money. But I didn't find that one until much later as well. So it's like I’m part of that, more popular later one. I think that that's fair. I think that's a fair—that it is.
[KARLI] Yeah, okay. So that's, that's one of mine. And then Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas.
[JAMIE] Oh, I need to watch that. That's one I've never seen.
[KARLI] You need to watch it. I need to rewatch it. It's been so long. But that is actually one of the first ones I’ve, I ever saw. And it was just weird in all of the best ways. And I just—I loved it. Yeah. You mentioned a couple of the other ones. Napoleon Dynamite, Boondock Saints. Uh, would Labyrinth be classified as that? Because I don't remember if it was super popular when it came out or not, but I didn't see it until I was an adult.
[JAMIE] I don't know. I would have to like, Yeah, I know it. Does it have a huge following?
[KARLI] It has a pretty big following from a group—I mean, like I said, I don't know how big the group has to be [laughing] in order for it to, you know, like—
[JAMIE] We need a—there’s a sign up sheet. [laughs]
[KARLI] Exactly. So yeah, I'm curious if anybody knows if that would be classified as a cult classic. Let us know.
[JAMIE] Yeah. I’m not sure about that one.
[KARLI] Yeah, Monty Python. Was The Princess Bride a cult classic, or was that popular when it came out too? See I just—I don't know—I just have questions. So many questions. [chuckles]
[JAMIE] I've never considered it a cult classic. I know. It does have a lot of fans. But I just assumed it's always been pretty...
[KARLI] That's what I assumed too but...
[JAMIE] I think Princess Bride is a cult classic. But if I'm going to pick of Cary Elwes, I hope I'm pronouncing his name right. The guy who plays Westley in The Princess Bride, when I think of him, I think Men in Tights [Karli laughs] is more of a cult classic.
[KARLI] Oh, I forgot about that. And I even did see that one growing up. So yep, that's on my list too.
[JAMIE] That one is more a cult classic, I think because it's more obscure.
[KARLI] It's more obscure. It's quirky, and it's meant to be. And then I had, I had another question. Suprise!
[JAMIE] Mhmm, mhmm.
[KARLI] TV show-wise. And it, it could just be that I didn't hear about it. But listen, I didn't know about a lot of things until I was an adult. I didn't know that TV shows like were serial, like they kept running and there was like an over arcing story until I was in my...
[JAMIE] She didn't get it.
[KARLI] Til I was in my 20s, you guys. In this regard, [laughing] I was living under a rock. [Jamie laughs] So would Arrested Development be?
[JAMIE] Yes.
[KARLI] Yay! I put it on my list. I feel so proud. I was like I think it is, I think it is!
[JAMIE] It had bad ratings the whole time it was on. I mean...
[KARLI] It's hilarious! [Karli laughs]
[JAMIE] It's one of—I don't count the new season but the old season.
[KARLI] Yeah.
[JAMIE] Very, very much. So I should have written I didn't think about television because I was like, oh, there's so much to unpack. [laughs]
[KARLI] There is, there really is. But I really wanted to know about that one because I felt like it was and I was like, I need just—trust your gut, put it on the list. Put it on the list. Very proud of myself.
[JAMIE] I didn't even know you watched Arrested Development.
[KARLI] I haven't seen all of it. But I've seen a few seasons and I love it. I think it's hilarious.
[JAMIE] Especially if you like the Smartless podcast. You have to have watched Arrested Development.
[KARLI] I mean, you know, I'm an enormous fan of Jason Bateman and Will Arnett, and it just—yeah. Those were all of my favorites, except I'm saving one for my recommendation later.
[JAMIE] Okay. Each of my favorites. I have like a little, a little story.
[KARLI] Enter Jamie’s monologue now.
[JAMIE] Yes, yes, Karli can leave, go get coffee, take a break. Chillax.
[KARLI] Take a nap.
[JAMIE] My number one is Monty Python and the Holy Grail. And there was a time in high school, we had a group of friends that for a year, on every single one of our birthdays, [laughing] we got together and watched Monty Python and the Holy Grail. So we watched it at least eight times in one year.
[LAUGHTER]
[KARLI] I believe, I believe that.
[JAMIE] We were very much part of the cult on that one.
[KARLI] I love Monty Python now. But the first time I saw it, I hated it. With like, a fiery passion. I hated it. And—
[JAMIE] Why?
[KARLI] [stage whisper] Because it was blasphemous. [laughs] [normal voice] That was my, that was—
[JAMIE] [laughing] I can’t—
[KARLI] I know it was a whole phase for me. [laughing] Don’t judge me too harshly for it, or do, I don't know, I judge me pretty harshly for that phase.
[JAMIE] What's blasphemous about the Holy Hand Grenade?
[LAUGHTER]
[KARLI] I don't know, Ja—I had problems back then, okay? [Jamie laughs] I have since matured as a human being, and my taste has improved, obviously. I love that movie now. It's fantastic. It's very quotable. I love it.
[JAMIE] Did you feel a lot of peer pressure about that?
[KARLI] That I didn't like it? Yeah, I did.
[JAMIE] You were like I better keep watching over and over until I like it, otherwise—
[KARLI] Especially because the, the cult following that included your niche group that I was not a part of that I felt very like, I should like this because they all like it. And I was like, I don't like it.
[LAUGHTER]
[JAMIE] The next one on my list of favorites brings us back around to the, my dad was a nerd who begat a nerd. Army of Darkness. I remember seeing this on our TV so many times. We--not Evil Dead. I was not allowed to watch Evil Dead. That was, [laughs] too much. But "Shop smart, shop Smart." I've definitely seen that many, many times. Of course Fight Club, which I was not allowed to see at the time. Of course.
[KARLI] No, that's an adult movie.
[JAMIE] That's an adult movie, wait till you are an adult to see. But that kind of keeps in the whole theme of very uh, narrative style bending.
[KARLI] Yes.
[JAMIE] And my last one, which is Shaolin Soccer, which is a hilarious comedy about using the art of Shaolin Kung Fu to win soccer games. [laughs]
[KARLI] That sounds rad I, I could be into that.
[JAMIE] Yeah, it's it's a good one.
[KARLI] Nice.
[JAMIE] When you go online, you can find hundreds of lists of the best cult classics. I doubt anybody likes all of the movies on those lists.
[KARLI] Yeah.
[JAMIE] It's uh, they're niche. And they're each their own niche within the niche.
[KARLI] I did notice that because that's how I found my list because I had a couple like running around in my head when you pitched this episode. I'm like, well, obviously Rocky Horror Picture Show, Pulp Fiction, like everybody knows of those ones. [mumbling] I feel like, for the most part, ya know, blanket statement. [regular voice] But I was like, I don't know if I've seen any myself. And so I had to go to the lists to make my list and like be like, oh, that one. Oh, I have seen that one. Oh, I like that one. And uh, but I definitely noticed them like, these swing one way and then the other and there's this and that and they—each are totally obscure and their own little category in and of themselves. It’s, it's very interesting to go look at those lists, especially for someone who just is like, I don't know what I'm doing here.
[JAMIE] Yeah, I reviewed the list too, because sometimes there's movies you haven't seen in years and you're like, oh, yeah! Certain directors lend themselves to cult classics as well. Sam Raimi, who's you know, Army of Darkness, Evil Dead. And then he went on to do the Tobey Maguire Spider Man.
[KARLI] Oh, I did not—interesting. [chuckles]
[JAMIE] Yeah. With the Tobey Maguire Spider Man where they do the Doctor Oc waking up and everything. Like that whole sequence screams Sam Raimi and has a total Army of Darkness feel with the quick cuts, the cinematography of it. Really good.
[KARLI] I'll have to—I still need to watch Army of Darkness.
[JAMIE] Other directors who lend themselves to this are Quentin Tarantino, Edgar Wright.
[KARLI] Yeah.
[JAMIE] Because Shaun of the Dead.
[KARLI] Yeah. Oh, yeah. And obviously like Mel Brooks and, and the like.
[JAMIE] Yes. So the, like the third point of my has to reach these standards for a cult classic is very much distinct feel, tone, and cinematography.
[KARLI] Yeah.
[JAMIE] Because if it just feels like every other movie, it doesn't have that special something.
[KARLI] It's got to have the special sauce. Secret Sauce. [Jamie chuckles]
[JAMIE] My closing thoughts. What a cult classic is depends on who you ask. [Karli laughs] But the most important factor is the avid fan base. We put the cult and cult classic.
[KARLI] Look at you.
[JAMIE] Give us our recommendation for the week, Karli.
[KARLI] Oh, okay, so my two cent recommendation for this week is in theme. It is another example of some directors that lend themselves to cult classic type. And that is the Hess duo. A husband and wife team. They're best known for what we mentioned earlier, Napoleon Dynamite. They also did Nacho Libre, but my recommendation for this week is Gentlemen Broncos. And it is obviously of the same ilk. If you liked Napoleon Dynamite and Nacho Libre then you might like Gentlemen Broncos and I am only saying might because it is very bizarre, but I really enjoyed it. It's, it's its own, its own wild thing, but it's a good time.
[JAMIE] I haven't seen that one. I wrote it down. I'm like, oh, can I stream this anywhere? I'm probably gonna have to rent it.
[KARLI] Probably.
[JAMIE] Ah! Three dollar rentals.
[KARLI] The indignation.
[JAMIE] Jeesh. I can't believe this. [chuckles]
[BOTH] This is egregious.
[LAUGHTER]
[KARLI] We're just too much. Sometimes.
[JAMIE] It, is too much. If you have no idea of any of the movies we're talking about, I apologize. But I highly recommend a bunch of them. But if you want a specific, like you want a recommendation tailored to your liking, you feel free to DM me. Tell me some of the works that you do like and I will try and pick...
[KARLI] Ooh.
[JAMIE] The best cult classic to suit what I think your tastes might be.
[KARLI] That's quite a challenge.
[JAMIE] I like, I like a little bit of a challenge.
[KARLI] You do.
[JAMIE] There is no guarantee that you will like it. No, no money back. There will be no refund.
[KARLI] [laughing] There is no money back guarantee on this situation.
[JAMIE] Thanks for listening. Find us on Instagram and Twitter at @theactbreak_podcast or if it's Twitter, leave off the podcast part. Follow or subscribe on your podcast delivery system of choice. Find our backlog of episodes, as well as transcripts for every episode this season on our website, scifiohmy.com. Click on podcast. Sign up for our newsletter while you're there, uh, for exclusive content. [stage whisper] That’s a lie. [Karli laughs] [mocking voice] Sign up you'll get something nobody else is gonna get.
[KARLI] Well I mean, kind of because we do send out like, things that we're enjoying like right now like recommendations. That’s, that's exclusive. [sarcastic voice] We don't share those with just anybody, guys.
[JAMIE] But I mean we would if anybody asked. [laughs]
[KARLI] Shhh, don't tell them.
[JAMIE] Sign up for the newsletter! [both laugh]
[KARLI] Bye, internet friends!